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November 14, 2007
Yorvit Torrealba
With the exception of Blastings Thrilledge, I have not seen anyone put a positive spin on this deal, let alone come out in favor of it. So, there is really no reason to elaborate on the fact Paul Lo Duca would have commanded the same amount of money Home: .296/.353/.424 Away: .212/.292/.326 In one respect, the deal does make sense; from the perspective of someone that has campaigned for starting Castro everyday numerous times, you take way the risk factor by having him catch roughly 60% of the games. But in may others, the deal makes zero sense; $15 million for a catcher who like will not give you league average production both offensively and defensively? Which brings up the question, why would Minaya pull the trigger on this deal? I am sorry, I often give Minaya the benefit of the doubt that his most recent deals, (Burgos-Bannister; Bostick, Vargas- Owens, Lindstrom) were 20/20 hindsight, but $15 million a year for Yorvit Torrealba? Call me a Pollyanna, but I do not even think Omar is capable of not seeing the pure logic here. Predictably, the first thing that comes to mind is the race factor and Minaya’s possible inclination towards Hispanic players, but not only do I highly doubt this, but I cannot really think of a deal involving Hispanic players that blatantly favored another team or will even come back to tremendously backfire. Between the three most glaring deals Minaya made last off-season, (Bell, Burgos, Lindstrom, Owens) only one involved Minaya receiving a Hispanic player in return, (Burgos) unless only you are counting Varag’s ancestry. To be honest, after striking out just four batters per game last year in the American League, I do not even seeing Bannister repeating his 07 success with the Kansas City Royals any time soon. No, the real answer can be found when you look back at the signing of Scott Schioenweis to a three year deal, or Guillermo Mota fresh of the steroid scandal, or the Jeff Conine-Sean Henry swap late last year. Minaya felt he had to fill a void, and he did so by signing a name. As Dave Cameron put it a few days back over at U.S.S. Mariner, when alluding to the demand for Kyle Lohse this off-season, “Every single 2008 Triple-A rotation will have at least one guy who could give you 95% of Kyle Lohse’s production for 3% of the cost.” Well Mets fans, you have your version of Klye Lohse in Torrealba. You could probably get 95% of his production at 3% of the cost from Mike Defiliece , or 96% at 2% of the cost y telling Joe Hepitas to screw his transition to a relief pitcher and have him split catching duties with Castro. Further, unlike other teams, if 10 years and $300-$400 million for Alex Rodriguez is not going to break the bank for the Wilpon’s, than neither will a multi-year contract for Torrealba. But in an efficient market, does this deal make any sense whatsoever? Not even close. But for the media, it sure does. You can contact matt at: matthimelfarb@gmail.com 15 Responses to “Yorvit Torrealba”Leave a ReplyYou must be logged in to post a comment. |
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reports i have read are at 3 years, 5 million per.
While i think he is still grabage, i don’t think this is outragous considering what is available. I would prefer Ramon Hernandez but not at the cost of a higher level prospect.
Torrealba’s home/road splits are misleading, and come in a small sample size.
Yes, Torrealba was bad on the road in 2007:
2007
Home: .296/.353/.424
Road: .212/.292/.326
But what about this?
2006
Home: .222/.281/.402
Road: .274/.306/.481
And this?
2003
Home: .245/.292/.364
Road: .278/.337/.422
I’m not a big fan of the signing, to tell you the truth. But remember who Yorvit will be replacing: a very overrated Paul Lo Duca. PLD was pretty useless in 2007 and will be 36 next year. If Torrealba hits near his career norms he’ll replace PLD’s 80 OPS+. I’d rather have an upgrade or a player with some upside, but considering the many needs of this team I’ll grudgingly settle for treading water.
There are lots of guys I’d rather have than Yorvit, but all of them cost prospects. Our catching will be mediocre for a couple of years, but lots of teams win with mediocre catching. Now let’s go solve our real problems.
Generally speaking, it’s not a good idea to use home road splits. Data, even in an extreme park, is still data and should not be thrown out. Overemphasing home / road splits is what lead to some writers underrating Alfonso Soriano when he was traded from Texas to Washington.
It’s better to simply adjust for park effects.
Yorvit’s career OPS+ is 80. Last 3 years, 70, 78, 75. In a full season, about 15-20 runs below average. That’s pretty mediocre, even for a catcher.
Basically, this is an overpay. But it only cost money.
I’d rather have Ramon Hernandez, but he’s going to cost talent. Would Mets fans be willing to give up something like Mulvey / Niese + Carp for Hernandez?
Why don’t we bring some WARP3 into this.
This past 3 seasons he has had WARP3 of 1.1, 2.6 & 4.1. These numbers don’t really represent improvement in season, but are more reflective of the fact he played 108 (42g), 223 (64g) and 396 AB (113g) respectivily. So assuming he playes 70 games, posts WARP3 in the 2 range. According to this salary scale (which may I note seems way to high) he should command a 3 year $21 million contract.
Not agreeing or disagree with this, just presenting the numbers.
#4
That salary scale is not calibrated for WARP3. The replacement level used in that salary scale is set higher, about 20 runs, or 2 wins, higher than the replacement level of WARP3.
The only thing I like about Yorvit Torrealba is saying his name. I hope he hits better than Anderson Hernandez.
I am really surprised at how many people are down on the Yorvit signing. I actually think this is a pretty good move. No the $$$ don’t make as much sense as I would like, but like it or not Yorvit was the best bet on the FA market today. He is a 29/30 year old catcher with a log of games left in the tank behind the plate. PLD while I loved rooting for the guy, should NOT be getting a long term deal. And that is exactly what he is looking for a 3 or 4 year deal. He keeps talking about wanting to “retire” as a Met. I am sorry, but a 3 year deal with PLD would be a GIGANTIC blunder.
Now, we could have waited around and hoped that the market never materialized for PLD and picked him up at a more reasonable 2 year deal with a lot of incentives in the second year. However, in that situation a guy like PLD would be offended by the Mets “not respecting him” and would probably take less money from another team to play for them. To me playing a waiting game with PLD would be a big risk as other FAs would all be gone and we would be stuck in a really tight trade market or with a long contract with PLD to “show respect”.
Is the 15 mil too much for Yorvit? Yes. Minaya paid a premium to resolve the position right away and to get the best FA on the market. I will also bet right now that Yorvit has a more productive season next year than PLD wherever he ends up, and I 100% guarantee he will be more valuable for 3 years than PLD will be.
Also, keep in mind the numbers he threw out this year were a big drop off for him, he threw out closer to 40% the previous years. Not sure why this happened, but I do know PLD has never even come close to throwing out that many base runners.
If 14.4 mil. doesn’t make sense for Torrealba, what about 4.6? Switch Castro’s and Torrealba’s contracts, and this all makes a lot more sense.
Yorvit is the sound you make when hugging the bowl after a long night drinking gin.
Reposted (again) for those who didn´t see it. There are things that can´t be measured by numbers.
November 14th, 2007 at 4:46 pm
…posted by Matthew Cerrone…
…i just hung up the phone with Troy E. Renck, who does an amazing job covering baseball and the Rockies for the Denver Post…i reached out to him in an effort to learn a bit more about free-agent C Yorvit Torrealba, who, according to Newsday, is close to agreeing on a deal with the Mets…
Renck, on Torrealba’s overall game…
“He had an opportunity to be the opening-day catcher in 2006, but he struggled. He got in to a problem where he lifted too much in Venezuela in the off-season and he regretted it. In the process, he lost his arm slot, and had arm problems during his first year with the Rockies, which was disappointing, but he did reveal that he’s a clutch hitter and pitchers like the way he received and called the game…During the season it became obvious that the pitching staff had an unbelievable comfort level with him…
“Torrealba’s main value is that he has passion, he has leadership qualities and he worked wonders with their pitchers. He knew when to give them a pat on the back or a kick in the butt…
“There were some whispers that the Rockies were not totally happy with his play-calling in 2006, but not only was that not a concern in 2007, but it was considered his strength. The team’s manager, Clint Hurdle, went out of his way on repeated occasions to talk about how he thought what a terrific job Torrealba was doing calling games.”
Renck, on Torrealba’s ability to deal with media, since, in New York, the catcher is often asked to address reporters regarding that day’s starting pitcher…
“He was very accessible to me, I had a great relationship with him and I found him to be very open, very candid and very insightful. He didn’t try to butter everything up. When a guy pitched poorly he explained to me why he pitched poorly without ripping him. If he felt like he called the wrong pitches he took credit for that…
“In the playoffs he loved the attention, he gravitated towards the spotlight. He held court at his locker at several times…Now, how he’ll deal with 10 or 15 reporters, during like what the Mets went through last year, that I don’t know. I mean, he can be a little moody, but, to me, it’s a by-product of his passion…
“He cares deeply about winning. So, sometimes when he gets upset, it’s not to be a jerk, it’s because he is genuinely upset and he doesn’t want to say the wrong thing, because he cares so much about winning – and I think that’s what his teammates respond so much to.”
but he did reveal that he’s a clutch hitter
“Torrealba’s main value is that he has passion, he has leadership qualities and he worked wonders with their pitchers. He knew when to give them a pat on the back or a kick in the butt…
I don’t know how to do that thing where quoted text gets put in a white box. but am I the only one who sees paying for something like this as anenormous problem?
I’d call it a very slight upgrade over LoDuca’s diminshing returns and leave it at that.
I liked this deal, too bad it seems Yorvit’s arm wasn’t sound. I hope this doesn’t mean that we will have to bring in PLD for a 3 year deal, that would be a big mistake IMO. Possibly a bad deal for next year, definitely for 09 and 10.
I’d rather have DiFelice playing for the minimum than either PLD or Torrealba for their asking prices.